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  1. #11
    tomgtv's Avatar
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    Aha.....there are some thinking people on Greenhulk!

    You cannot pass laws in the US and think that will in some way affect
    Islamic Terrorists. Oh Jeez, they passed the Patriot act, we'd better cool it! yeah right.

    When you ignore the US Constitution by using illegal wiretaps on US citizens, conducting torture, holding people prisoner with no legal due process, invade countries under false pretexts......all done in the name of "protecting our freedoms"......you my friend have committed the gravest insult to all those who have sacrificed their lives and fortunes in defense of these values.

    National ID? Wrong, wrong, wrong. We have way too many controls on us by the government. You effectively lose when you are charged by a US or State attorney with crimes of treason or sedition. They have unlimited power, money and people to try you. They have the weight of the public accusation in their favor....."he must have done something or they would not have charged him"......yeah right...... Tell that to the people who have been put to death without the benefit of modern day DNA analysis.

    Our well opinionated poster YoYamma has asked the rhetorical question "have you known anybody that has been wiretapped?" HOW WOULD YOU KNOW? Send emails or talk on the phone with the right words and the next knock you hear on your door may not be the Pizza man. I dare you........


  2. #12

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    Do I know of anyone who has been wiretapped? How about everyone here. See, there are things not widely known, that I promise you, you do not want to know... but on the otherhand, it is impossible to truly make an informed decision without the truth.

    The ugly truth involves AT&T, the NSA, and a place in San Francisco called room 641A: http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...affic-too.html

    BTW, I'm not trying to act like I'm some government insider who knows all the secrets, because I'm not (and no one knows all the secrets). I'm simply an engineer who must research and learn when confronted with anything that doesn't make sense. Much like my boat, not a lot of mystery left in that for me.
    Last edited by VX1; 09-09-2008 at 02:53 PM.

  3. #13
    tomgtv's Avatar
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    NSA has biggest budget and

    its all classified. Most of what NSA does is information related.

    Have you ever heard of "pattern recognition software". What is
    the biggest use of Super Computers in the government......weather....
    wrong answer......looking for stuff without search warrants or
    probable cause.......you're getting close.......

    Big Brother, 1984, and the effective repeal of US Constitutionally guaranteed
    rights have been totally abused by this REPUBLICAN administration. Cheny
    couldn't even show his face at the convention.....even McCain realized that....

    Yeah......lets have a National ID, how about a nice concentration camp tattoo to go along with it. Then when they are strip searching grandmothers at the airport they can more easily enter them into their databases........

  4. #14
    Chrisrokc's Avatar
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    I don't see the problem with a national ID card. It would make the country more secure. Hell we already have to show our drivers license every where we go. Whats the difference in showing a national ID card.

  5. #15
    AWA Member 32DegH2O's Avatar
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    It's not like any of things could be forged...so why bother with them...it does make it tougher for the terrorist but where there's a will there's a way...they'll figure a way sooner or later. The only way to really do an ID card is with retina scan or dna scan...but who's set up for that yet? Besides I don't think the public is ready for such privacy interferance. Nothing is ever going to be good enough no matter what they do...from where I stand, I see the government as becoming more of an enemy than any other source. I've worked on top secret projects with the govenment and there's some scary things going on and in the works...I'm talking about what freedoms (if you can call them that) we have left! Good luck to us all....

  6. #16
    Chrisrokc's Avatar
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    This is to add onto and straighten out this NSA wire tapping junk on here. I have taken several class taught by a retired head CIA official. There was stuff he could tell us, then there was stuff he couldn't, then there was stuff he could just kinda nod if we found it on our own.

    Throughout the United States there are distribution hubs for phone and internet services. At these hubs there are computer or links that track every communication that goes though. It looks for keywords in the communication then stores the phone call, email, google search, ect. in the databank. It also will tap every piece of known communication of a flagged person. It is then gone through manually by analysts at the NSA. I will throw out an example. Your friend calls you on a sunday afternoon and says, "Last night we had a bomb ass party. I am getting on an airplane this afternoon to new york". The system will grab the word "bomb" and "airplane" and throw the conversation in the databank. We never talked about if certain things are flagged higher priority than others, but calls and emails have to be gone through manually. Another example is a pre 9/11 one. A 9/11 high jacker called over seas to another conspirator. The conversation went something like this according to my teacher, "how are you today" "good" "how is your bakery" "it is great, I just finished a cake, it has a circle and three sticks on it" "that is good to hear". I forget if the conversation this was in farsi or arabic. It was flagged because the callers where flagged. This call was listened to and reviewed a day or so after 9/11. It was a phone call letting the others know when the attack was going to happen.

    That is just to give you an idea of how the system works. This system needs to be in place in the world we live in today. With out it this network of phones and internet we developed can be used against us. Just remember the United States government and your local government is not out to get you for small things. They could care less. They use this system to catch big fish.

    If people are interested in the subject more I would recommend a book called "chatter". It has the best information, even though some of it is false.

  7. #17
    Chrisrokc's Avatar
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    I figured the national IDs will have RDIF chips in them with a special key to access all of your information in a National Database. When going through security check points at the airport, or crossing the border, it would be easy for them to check each individual person with out the person even pulling out the ID. Facial recognition is being used today, so is walking recognition. All of this combined would make it impossible for a terrorist to make a fake national ID card.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by tomgtv View Post
    You cannot pass laws in the US and think that will in some way affect Islamic Terrorists. Oh Jeez, they passed the Patriot act, we'd better cool it! yeah right.

    When you ignore the US Constitution by using illegal wiretaps on US citizens, blah blah blah...
    U.S. citizens...? HOLD IT RIGHT THERE, Commodore.
    Go back and read my first post again, about the terrorist cells we have busted in Buffalo, Portland, Detroit, and Seattle. Did you even read that Commodore? Because any of those guys would easily pass for U.S. CITIZENS. The real question is---why wouldn't left wingers want to know what they are planning?

    Our well opinionated poster YoYamma has asked the rhetorical question "have you known anybody that has been wiretapped?" HOW WOULD YOU KNOW? Send emails or talk on the phone with the right words and the next knock you hear on your door may not be the Pizza man. I dare you....
    Yes, we have already been watching you Tom, your comments on this very thread are being monitored even now...


  9. #19
    Pettee's Avatar
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    I got a divers license with my photo, address, date of birth, etc, in my wallet behind it i carry my social security card. combine the two, save me wallet space. With those the .gov can get all the info they want on me.

    I've got nothing to hide from the .gov. Wiretap my ass all you want, all you're gonna get is fish stories, literally, and me bitching about the weather, NHC, work, etc etc.

    The ACLU is on the wrong side of so many issues I don't even pay attention to what they say. Very rarely do they get things right. They've been aiding and abetting enemies of the US since 1920. I don't care about wiretaps. Have they listened to mine? yeah, but nothing will ever be done with it, cause they're all worthless, unless the next president wants a good yellowtail hole, they'll have to kill me for those coordinates.


    And the proper response to 9/11 was to kill those responsible, and any and all those who share the same twisted beliefs.


    To everyone who disagrees, this is my opinion, respect it and i'll respect yours.

  10. #20

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    Quote Originally Posted by Pettee
    They've been aiding and abetting enemies of the US since 1920.
    Please don't take this in some way as a defense of the ACLU (I'm about as far from the liberal side of the spectrum as it gets), but talk about aiding and abetting the enemy, look into Prescott Bush, father of George H. Bush. In 1942, he was busted for working with the enemy (Trading with the Enemy Act of 1917). He just happened to be working with some of those previously-mentioned evil international bankers. It would absolutely blow your mind if you started down that rabbit hole. Look it up.

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