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  1. #1

    Yamaha 2019 VXR Full Throttle at start. Need help!

    HI All!

    I have a 2019 VXR (26 hours and all fresh water) that is running full tilt 7500+ RPMs when started. YDS shows code 63 after clearing each time. Yamaha Tech support said a Gel Battery could be the issue. I changed it out to an old acid battery and it is the same issue. Sprayed all over for a possible vacuum leak. None detected. New Pressure sensor as well. Throttle body reads normal. When you hit the throttle it gets boggy. In my mind, this thing is getting way to much fuel in the injectors at start. I talked to RIVA (I am in Michigan) and they think electronic throttle sensor or throttle body. But how could it get that much fuel? I suspect the ECM is telling it to send that much fuel. Riva disagrees and has not ever seen that. All wires look good no corrosion or unplugged wires to the harness. My dealer is stumped and I could use some help.

    Thanks!

    Johnny

  2. #2
    Click avatar for tech links/info K447's Avatar
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    Welcome.

    Has this watercraft ever worked properly for you?

    Has anything changed or recent service just before the problem began?

    Out of the water it does not take much power/fuel to rev the engine to the moon.

    In the water testing may provide some useful info for diagnostics.

    Can you take it to a launch ramp?

    If so, strap it down strongly front and rear to the trailer. Back it down the ramp until the jet pump is entirely submerged. Leave the seat off.

    Make sure the ramp bottom and nearby water is clear of debris.

    Now when you start the engine there will be a water load on the jet pump. See if it revs to redline or something much lower. Does it settle down after a short while running?

    You can run the engine on the ramp in the water as long as needed, there is no risk of overheat or other damage (presuming the cooling system is flowing water in the normal manner).

    You can apply throttle and see how the engine responds. Look for exhaust smoke, anything unusual.

  3. #3
    ShawnInFL's Avatar
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    Sounds like an intake issue to me based on that code. Gel battery, that made me laugh. I've had issue with throttle position sensor once, it didn't cause it to over rev though, was an 09 FX SVHO. Would definitely avoid those kind of RPM's without having it in the water. Hitting those revs dry, you might be causing more damage soon enough. Lanyard a must on this one. Good luck and keep us posted.

  4. #4
    dannyual777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waverrunner Johnny View Post
    HI All!

    I have a 2019 VXR (26 hours and all fresh water) that is running full tilt 7500+ RPMs when started. YDS shows code 63 after clearing each time. Yamaha Tech support said a Gel Battery could be the issue. I changed it out to an old acid battery and it is the same issue. Sprayed all over for a possible vacuum leak. None detected. New Pressure sensor as well. Throttle body reads normal. When you hit the throttle it gets boggy. In my mind, this thing is getting way to much fuel in the injectors at start. I talked to RIVA (I am in Michigan) and they think electronic throttle sensor or throttle body. But how could it get that much fuel? I suspect the ECM is telling it to send that much fuel. Riva disagrees and has not ever seen that. All wires look good no corrosion or unplugged wires to the harness. My dealer is stumped and I could use some help.

    Thanks!

    Johnny
    It's stuff like this that really make me doubt the knowledge and technical capabilities of the so called experts.

  5. #5
    Click avatar for tech links/info K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waverrunner Johnny View Post
    … Yamaha Tech support said a Gel Battery could be the issue.

    I changed it out to an old acid battery and it is the same issue.
    There are no gel batteries used in PWC. Gel batteries are not suitable for vibration and impact environments. The gel develops internal voids (cracks) and the gel battery degrades. Gel batteries are not sold for use in PWC and I have never seen an actual gel battery installed in a PWC.

    Old-school lead-acid batteries are widely understood and from that familiarity comes some notion that they are ‘trustworthy’. They of course are prone to self-discharge, can emit acid fumes (hence the need for a vent tube) and sometimes even leak acid.

    The modern AGM battery, is sometimes called a ‘dry’ battery because no liquid acid will leak out even if the battery was pierced or cracked open. This is also true of a gel battery, but an AGM battery is not a gel battery.

    AGM batteries come in factory sealed form (my preferred Deka ETX series is factory sealed) or sold with acid separately added to ‘activate’ the battery at time of purchase. AGM acid is a different mix than that for traditional lead-acid. Once the acid is added and soaks into the glass mats the activated AGM battery will not leak acid even if inverted or damaged.

    Once installed in the watercraft an AGM battery works the same as lead-acid. Engine starts the same, charging system voltages are the same. The electronics have no idea which battery type is installed. All they see is the voltage is quite stable, even during cranking.

    Of course loose battery cable connections and other problems can still occur, but an AGM battery in good condition ‘causing’ electrical system trouble is not a valid diagnostic approach.

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  7. #6
    Update: With a code 63 and both the temp sensor and pressure sensor and hose replaced, support now feels that it has to be an intake air leak issue. I need this opinion, Do you think I am on the right track with replacing the injector orings, intake orings, and throttle body gasket? Any other thoughts on where the air leak could come in? Crankcase and oil cooler breather hoses have been checked and replaced. Also, while I am at it, should I consider a upgrade to a billet boot and ribbon delete while I am at it?

    Thanks! Johnny

  8. #7
    Click avatar for tech links/info K447's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Waverrunner Johnny View Post
    Update: With a code 63 and both the temp sensor and pressure sensor and hose replaced, support now feels that it has to be an intake air leak issue.

    … on the right track with replacing the injector orings, intake orings, and throttle body gasket? Any other thoughts on where the air leak could come in?

    Crankcase and oil cooler breather hoses have been checked and replaced.

    Also, while I am at it, should I consider a upgrade to a billet boot and ribbon delete while I am at it?

    Thanks! Johnny
    What is a ‘billet boot’?

    Did you try the in-water on-trailer test?

    Have you looked for loose bolts (or other problems) at the throttle body where it attaches to the intake manifold?

  9. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by dannyual777 View Post
    It's stuff like this that really make me doubt the knowledge and technical capabilities of the so called experts.
    yes but i was an instrument technician for xom and that was always my first instinct- what changed

  10. #9
    I did put it in water. It is strong enough to move it on a load at idle and it bogs out when you hit the throttle. Yamaha is convinced it is an air leak. We sprayed the entire area with soapy water and found nothing that bogged it down "to stop an air leak". They don't believe it is the ecm or the throttle body. So in my mind, the next step is to take off the intake and look at everything closely. Any suggestions or suspensions on where to start? One more piece of information to mention, it did have an overheating issue before all of this due to a faulty thermostat. Again, it has code 63 for intake air issue and we have replaced the pressure sensor and temp sensor. Aluminum intake boot. Many folks on this site recommend that and the ribbon delete to increase airflow.

  11. #10
    Click avatar for tech links/info K447's Avatar
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    The aftermarket air intake parts would not materially affect engine operation at low throttle. Something else is affecting the engine.

    Yes, there is a code for the air intake system. Is it possible the sensor itself was damaged by the engine overheat? So the ECU is receiving false sensor readings?

    Or the subsequent work done to diagnose and resolve the problem, something may have been damaged, left unplugged?

    My initial thought was perhaps a fuel injector is sticking open and over-fueling one cylinder?

    While you had it in the water did you try disabling one cylinder at a time to see if a specific cylinder affected the engine more/less than the others?


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