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  1. #31
    Bob 1tommygunner1927's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mittens View Post
    Ok putting parts together for a turbo build on my ski.

    I have yet to find the adapter / collector I need and want. Would rather have a billet piece but can make it with what I have. Plan to scan a new gasket with a 3d scanner and then mill a exact flange out of 1/2 stainless, then tig weld in stainless the water jacketed pipe to V band collector, and have dual ports like a few on here have done as well. (Unless I can get an adapter first)

    So comes the time to pick a turbo. The comp oilless one are neat, but they are not any cheaper, and running a oil lines should not be a issue. One assumption is I can use the oil feed my Riva super charger shaft is using, basically a tap at the oil pressure sensor, and feed that to the turbo of choice, and run the drain to the super charger block off. Can use the factory block off plate from HO, and the oil pump gear from a HO as well. Rremoving the clutch (main point for me doing turbo), remove idle gear, and blower. If this is not correct or will cause issues I am all ears.

    Turbos.... I had planned to use a EFR BW turbo, BUT I want to water jacketed turbine housing. Tial seems to be the only company producing a housing. The rest are just fabricators welding jackets around the housing with a water inlet and outlet feeding the new jacket on the normal turbine housing. Tial is made to fit the GT30 and GTX30 turbos with a internal wastegate. One forum member has suggested GTX3076r as a turbo, and so far has been what I am shopping. I want to say that I am building this for Pump gas, stock internals SVHO, so 20 psi ish is the goal. Not some drag only ski. This will be my only ski, drink beers ride creeks and rivers, trip to the beach a time or 2 a year ski. But I want it to spool fast but also not run out of room on the top end. Any suggestions? is the gtx3071r too small? risk running out of juice? so far 1349 for a Garret GTX3076R super core (without turbine housing) is the best deal I have found.

    In my opinion, a BorgWarner EFR 6758 or 7163 would fit your needs. Both can achieve 20+ pounds of boost. A water cooled jacket needs to welded to the turbine housing. Charge tube construction is easier as no blow-off valve is needed. Next item to consider is boost control: manual or electronic.


  2. #32
    Quote Originally Posted by 1_Fast_SHO View Post
    Why the long pipe, i would of relocated that intercooler to the back of the ski going over the intake side. Plus going with stainless wasnt the smartest idea. Stainless gets extremely hot. I would of went with titanium over stainless or aluminum. Good looking set up. Just not a fan of that long pipe.
    This set-up is basically a bolt-on, not much modifications are needed to get it to fit. If I wanted to I could unbolt the Turbo and manifolds and fit the SC back on without having to change any thing around. The Electrics dont have to be moved the IC as you pointed out isn't moved.
    With the over pipe it was the easiest option for where every thing is located. The Stainless works fine tbh, The only down side is the rate of heat dissipation, stainless will heat up slower compared to alloy/Titanium but also cool slower. but once they are at temp, they are at temp.
    My logging shows an engine temp of 86 degrees C, water temp 20 degrees C, Manifold air temp 31 degrees C. The manifold temp stays solid at 31-32 degrees C at WOT.
    It would be nice to know what the temp of the hot side of the IC would of been, but I think its doing a pretty good job!

  3. #33
    mittens's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ultramaxracing05 View Post
    I'm running 17 lbs, this turbo is good up to close to 30 psi. I would recommend water jacketing everything if possible. Also forget about the front mount. Most of the professionals and even most seadoos run a rear mount. I have some turbo flanges that I can waterjet to any size or sammay can sell you some. We installed them on the horizontal pipe after the collerctor where the temp sensor is located, the flange is bolted via 5 bolts, easier this way you just build you a J pipe which is the up pipe to the turbo and the rest is easy.
    Thank you great info on the 3071. I have seen a lot of rear mounts with the J pipe it sure looks easier I will agree to that.


    Quote Originally Posted by 1_Fast_SHO View Post
    anything can be made waterjacket, not sure whats the big deal with the midwall, its soo much easier to work on a ski with no midwall i am starting to remove them on every ski even supercharger. i have yet to see anybody keep a waterbox with a turbo set up, "pointless" the temp sensor can go on anything, you can source a copper t from home depot and put it there behind rectifier or buy a an fitting piece and install it, personally i think you need to stay supercharger. if you are picky about your ski you will not like anything related to a turbo set up on a ski, theres no way to make it look "pretty" or clean so to speak, there will be hoses running all over the place for cooling purposes, as for the oil line the length of the oil line has absolutely no effect on performance. rear mounts cars run stupid long oil lines with pumps to push oil back oil pan
    I don’t plan to keep the waterbox, just in my head seemed like a good Idea to keep the routing the same, so it was an option, and was planning to make a strain pipe for that section. And while I a picky about the ski and things hoses and functional parts are not my issue, I am a big guy and getting on and off a FZ in deep water is basically impossible with a cooler on the back so I am just not a fan. I have put a cooler in the front too, just like to have both storage areas. But the tinkering (gear head at heart), and No more clutch worries have me ready to swap. What do you think about the 3071? Vs the 3076? I Know you said 3076 before just curious if you think it wont be enough or any thoughts welcome. Also when doing the J pipe/ rear mount are you injecting water back into the exhaust after the turbo? Or is it just dry exhaust with water jacketed Down pipe?
    Quote Originally Posted by ultramaxracing05 View Post
    ditch the waterbox, your O2 sensors will last for a lot longer since there is no longer water in the waterbox to condensate while the ski is store to ruin them. I am running 2 O2 Sensors, one for the motec and another for my MTX-L gauge.

    I removed my midwall and installed all my electronics above the battery on the side of the ski with an aluminum plate I made.
    More room to work.

    The midwall is a pain in the ass period. My neighboor removed his on his stock Fx just for shits and grins so he can have the open room and made it a whole lot easier installing an exhaust system.

    If you tie into the collector you will have cracking issues on your clamp, there is a reason riva quit selling them, and GRF had seen where they cracked, so they went with the rear style J pipe.

    I would reccomend a rear set up, a riva side mount intercooler being modified by relocating one of the intake pipes to accept a pipe coming directly from the back of the ski, a pipe that runs parallel with the engine above the exhaust manifold into the intercooler and the intercooler will use the provided riva hoses to connect to the factory intake manifold via that J intake hose they include on the kit.
    I don’t plan to keep a waterbox, I think I remember seeing someome move the midwall to the side, and never having to add or cut wires, and mounted on an aluminum plate. Maybe this was you? Will do some searching.

    Quote Originally Posted by Luke1.8 View Post
    +1 on the rear mount
    Fully jacketed with the GTX 3071r fitted with custom wheel, same lag but much higher boost, beyond what the 3bar map sensor can read.
    I would even try the new garret G28 series if you are going new if you only want upto 21 psi it will be a snappy lil turbo!
    Running M130, with about to be a fully built motor. The only thing I would have done different is installed the CP pistons and not tried to get away with the stock pistons. Eng will now be fully built from top to bottom.
    Set up is for closed course so Top end isnt amazing but she grips and pulls none the less. currently at 8800 rev limit 21psi.
    your saying you run a 3071 but with a different turbine wheel or compressor wheel?


    Quote Originally Posted by 1tommygunner1927 View Post
    In my opinion, a BorgWarner EFR 6758 or 7163 would fit your needs. Both can achieve 20+ pounds of boost. A water cooled jacket needs to welded to the turbine housing. Charge tube construction is easier as no blow-off valve is needed. Next item to consider is boost control: manual or electronic.
    Thanks for the info

  4. #34
    Bob 1tommygunner1927's Avatar
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    Check out this build...seems the mid-wall is still intact!

    http://greenhulk.net/forums/showthre...hlight=ksalles

  5. #35
    Work Harder, Millions on Wellfare Depend On Us! ultramaxracing05's Avatar
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    If you remove the midwall on a gp no wires to cut, I think the only one what was in a bind was the exhaust temp wire which I just zip tied the sensor to the engine. Since I dont use it. Not sure if wire extensions are needed on a FZR.

    Keep in mind the midwall is trimmed, it still holds the mid bearing carrier strong enough you are just trimming it to give you the room. Also with a turbo you will most likely loose the room for the rear storage bin.

    Things to keep in mind.

  6. #36
    1_Fast_SHO's Avatar
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    IN RESPONSE TO THIS :I donít plan to keep the waterbox, just in my head seemed like a good Idea to keep the routing the same, so it was an option, and was planning to make a strain pipe for that section. And while I a picky about the ski and things hoses and functional parts are not my issue, I am a big guy and getting on and off a FZ in deep water is basically impossible with a cooler on the back so I am just not a fan. I have put a cooler in the front too, just like to have both storage areas. But the tinkering (gear head at heart), and No more clutch worries have me ready to swap. What do you think about the 3071? Vs the 3076? I Know you said 3076 before just curious if you think it wont be enough or any thoughts welcome. Also when doing the J pipe/ rear mount are you injecting water back into the exhaust after the turbo? Or is it just dry exhaust with water jacketed Down pipe?



    a front turbo set up exhaust pipe dumping on the stock location or riva exit will need a very long and heavy stainless exhaust, you may want to reconsider your set up or dump location.
    i have used both turbos you mentioned and honestly did not feel any difference between the two. at least not enough to pick one over the other i am currently running a gtx3076r on my fzr and it does just fine. and yes the pipe is waterjacket and injection so both.

  7. #37
    1_Fast_SHO's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Luke1.8 View Post
    This set-up is basically a bolt-on, not much modifications are needed to get it to fit. If I wanted to I could unbolt the Turbo and manifolds and fit the SC back on without having to change any thing around. The Electrics dont have to be moved the IC as you pointed out isn't moved.
    With the over pipe it was the easiest option for where every thing is located. The Stainless works fine tbh, The only down side is the rate of heat dissipation, stainless will heat up slower compared to alloy/Titanium but also cool slower. but once they are at temp, they are at temp.
    My logging shows an engine temp of 86 degrees C, water temp 20 degrees C, Manifold air temp 31 degrees C. The manifold temp stays solid at 31-32 degrees C at WOT.
    It would be nice to know what the temp of the hot side of the IC would of been, but I think its doing a pretty good job!
    as long as it works for you is all good, i just would of chose a different material and different path for that cold pipe. IMO

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1_Fast_SHO View Post
    a front turbo set up exhaust pipe dumping on the stock location or riva exit will need a very long and heavy stainless exhaust, you may want to reconsider your set up or dump location.
    i have used both turbos you mentioned and honestly did not feel any difference between the two. at least not enough to pick one over the other i am currently running a gtx3076r on my fzr and it does just fine. and yes the pipe is waterjacket and injection so both.
    Thanks for the info on the turbos. If not a noticeable difference between the 3071 and 3076 and it seems the 3071 will still produce more boost then I need on a stock short block, I may go with that just because it should spool quicker in theory. and still plenty big enough. I do understand dumping a front mount at the same location as the waterbox is a lot of pipe, (that's a good point as its all double pipe too when jacketed), Will think about it for sure. The rear mount is a lot less pipe for sure. I know making a J pipe is a lot easier then the other!

    so when you inject water back into the exhaust after the turbo, is it the old water feed that used to feed the water box? or is it all the water from the jacketing? I assume the old feed. and dump the new jacket feed/train over board?


    also a side note, I do apricate all the advice from this forum, as people who have done it and lived it will know more than anyone. I have been on the other side and advised someone how not to do it from experience only to watch them do it and fail. But I also have been determined to make something work and been successful so who knows which way I go. I will probably get the housing and turbo in hand and then see what kind of room options I have, and take all the points brought up in this thread to heart. They have not fell on deaf ears.

  9. #39
    Quote Originally Posted by mittens View Post
    Thanks for the info on the turbos. If not a noticeable difference between the 3071 and 3076 and it seems the 3071 will still produce more boost then I need on a stock short block, I may go with that just because it should spool quicker in theory. and still plenty big enough. I do understand dumping a front mount at the same location as the waterbox is a lot of pipe, (that's a good point as its all double pipe too when jacketed), Will think about it for sure. The rear mount is a lot less pipe for sure. I know making a J pipe is a lot easier then the other!

    so when you inject water back into the exhaust after the turbo, is it the old water feed that used to feed the water box? or is it all the water from the jacketing? I assume the old feed. and dump the new jacket feed/train over board?


    also a side note, I do apricate all the advice from this forum, as people who have done it and lived it will know more than anyone. I have been on the other side and advised someone how not to do it from experience only to watch them do it and fail. But I also have been determined to make something work and been successful so who knows which way I go. I will probably get the housing and turbo in hand and then see what kind of room options I have, and take all the points brought up in this thread to heart. They have not fell on deaf ears.
    Look at the newest line from Garret the G25-660 would be a better option than the GTX3071r for a stock motor, they have really good efficiency and will spool much quicker. they are a much smaller turbo but they punch out very good numbers.
    If It wasn't cheaper to have my GTX3071r customised I would have bought one.
    Yes its a custom compressor wheel and front of the compressor has been bored out and billet piece fitted.

  10. #40

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    How is GT2876R?
    Anyone have experience about that turbo?

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