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  1. #21
    Site Admin Green Hulk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatnissan View Post
    I’m assuming if you balance the xx wheel to the 300 charger you will not have issues ? Jerry is there anyway we can get these chargers bought balanced and ready to go ?
    the XXX is sold as a complete balanced supercharger
    https://www.4-tecperformance.com/ind...oducts_id=5413

  2. #22
    DR2006RXP's Avatar
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    Originally Posted by Green Hulk
    Roughly 45,000 RPM on older superchargers. The 300 superchargers spin 8% faster



    Flywheel gear ratio is 5.85 x 8050 that’s only 48k the

  3. #23
    Site Admin Green Hulk's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DR2006RXP View Post
    Flywheel gear ratio is 5.85 x 8050 that’s only 48k
    yes my mistake. The 120,000 rpm figure is what the 300 supercharger bearings are rated at.
    a 300 Engine spinning 8800 rpm has a supercharger spinning 51,500 RPM
    at 9000 RPM the supercharger is spinning 52,600 RPM
    these amounts are significantly higher than that of the older superchargers.


    here’s some more great info regarding the 300 chargers

    So where does some more of
    this extra power come from for New 2016+ SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP

    IT COMES FROM ADDED BOOST PRESSURE! The New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP has an all new supercharger in comparison to any of the
    previous engines. It flows 25% more air developing almost 30% more boost! (apprx. 3.5 lbs more boost pressure)

    This new supercharger is for the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP is now **MAINTENANCE FREE!!** Therefore under “normal use” no service is
    necessary.


    At first glance the supercharger looks the same but it is different in many ways. It has an all new turbine fan with twice
    as many blades, and also spins 8% faster due to a new drive gear ratio, New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP

    The target was to keep this supercharger as small as possible to maximize throttle response and minimize the inertia of the
    supercharger turbine. This is accomplished by utilizing a new supercharger
    turbine on the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP that measures 2 mm
    smaller diameter with more blades that increase airflow. -
    - The new turbine spins 8% faster and has twice the number of blades for New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP (32 vs. 16 blades for the 1503)
    (Although the turbine is smaller than on 1503HO the boost pressure is 30% higher, and this was possible with a combinationof a slightly increased supercharger speed (+7% to 8% or 3000rpm) and a detailed refinement of the complete supercharger
    geometry, starting from the intake diameter, the geometry of the supercharger wheel blades, the increased number of blades,
    and the flow geometry of flute and diffuser.) For the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP


    With a new supercharger gear, the turbine speed is now up to 46,800 RPM compared to 43,500 on the 1503. This is
    accomplished by changing the gear ratio on the supercharger drive gear and the flywheel ring gear to 5.85:1.

    These changes combined with the extra blades now found on the turbine is what gives us 25% more air developing almost
    30% more boost!

    COMPARISON INFO: 4TEC and New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP
    Gears used for 4TEC and New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP
    Drive gear: 16T (215/255/260)
    20T ( New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP)
    17T (185)
    Ring gear: 117T ( New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP = 5.85:1 ratio. (engine) 8000rpm x 5.85 = 46,800 RPM @ blower turbine)
    87T (4TEC 260 = 5.4375:1 ratio. (engine) 8000rpm x 5.4375 = 43,500 RPM @ blower turbine)

    The supercharger’s shaft diameter has been increased on the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HPfor added strength and durability. There are also less parts and optimized tolerances in production of the part, to contribute to this improvement.
    Another interesting feature is the use of completely new bearings to support the shaft: they are high performance hybrid
    ball bearings with metal races and silicon nitride balls for increased strength and high speed capability.



    These bearings are normally found in jet engine turbine shafts and high speed electric motors – they are high quality and
    designed for very high RPM application.

    With the larger turbine shaft size, for the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP the drive clutch design is also new. The friction surface area of the clutch slip washers for is increased over the 1503. (Notice the clutch surface area on the Supercharger Gear picture above) The coating is the
    same proven moly flame spray coating like on the 1503, with a new thrust surface polishing process.


    The conical bevel washer (spring washers) base material is new and made of an extremely tough steel material with more
    than double the lifetime of normal steel. Due to an optimized characteristic, the new conical bevel washers produce more
    clamping force of the clutch package with very good compensation of clutch wear, leading to longer life time. There are
    actually 8 conical bevel washers now instead of the previous 5.
    TECH SPECS 1630 SUPERCHARGER: As used on New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP

    SLIPPING MOMENT (NEW SUPERCHARGER)
    14 N•m to 17N•m (124 lbf•in to 150 lbf•in)

    SLIPPING MOMENT
    (BREAK-IN SUPERCHARGER)
    Minimum 11N•m (97 lbf•in)
    KEY MESSAGE:
    As we saw earlier, the supercharger is maintenance free. Part of the reason for this is the dynamic, high accuracy balancing
    of the complete supercharger assembly. Every supercharger is dynamically tested,
    measured, and adjusted prior to engine
    Assembly.
    Therefore, no repair parts or procedures will be required. The supercharger is available only as an assembly.



    The redesign of the supercharger allowed for increased lubrication by using a new special oiling system. In this picture
    we can see the location of the new
    oil spray nozzle. The oil is now precisely injected into the turbine shaft on the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP . Oil is directed
    in through the friction washers, bearings and gear for maximum cooling and lubrication.

    These refinements increase the precision with which oil can be accurately delivered to the supercharger bearings and
    friction clutch assembly on New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP


    The PTO and supercharger housings now have openings for oil to return from the supercharger bearing lubrication back
    to the PTO housing.

    The advantage of this is no more “splash” type oiling. This results in much improved oil flow and cooling at the bearings,
    leading to longer life, increased durability and no maintenance in normal conditions for the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP


    In addition to the supercharger lubrication system advances, ROTAX has also maximized the oiling characteristics and
    cooling of the upper rod bearing and piston dome for the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP

    These new oil spray nozzles have increased oil flow rate and optimized targeting for improved piston cooling. When we
    say “targeting” this means the position where the oil contacts the piston and how the oil is distributed to the piston.

    1.8 mm diameter of the( New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP ) oil nozzle instead of 1.4mm

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  5. #24
    ptscon's Avatar
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    We might be getting a billet watercooled charger from Art at ET in couple months.

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  7. #25
    In addition to the supercharger lubrication system advances, ROTAX has also maximized the oiling characteristics and
    cooling of the upper rod bearing and piston dome for the New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP

    These new oil spray nozzles have increased oil flow rate and optimized targeting for improved piston cooling. When we
    say “targeting” this means the position where the oil contacts the piston and how the oil is distributed to the piston.

    1.8 mm diameter of the( New 2016 SeaDoo ACE 1630 300HP ) oil nozzle instead of 1.4mm

    i wonder if we can put these fancy oil nozzles on a 260 block ?


  8. #26
    Quote Originally Posted by Green Hulk View Post
    if you look closely at the clutch end of the 300 supercharger you will see the supercharger has grind marks they use to balance it. You won’t see such marks on the 185/215/255/260 superchargers.

    call it a story if you want, but the fact is they do not offer rebuild kits because the shaft/rotating assembly must be balanced due to the very high RPM these superchargers turn. Food for thought, Sea Doo would make far more money selling us 4-6 rebuild kits for these superchargers over the life of the ski, rather than an occasional replacement supercharger when they fail.

    if you’ve gotten by without balancing then that’s great, you’ve been lucky this far. The odds are against you in that you will suffer a bearing failure due to a high speed imbalance.
    If you buy individually the clutch washers you will find the same marks before the assembly , I don't think that they are balancing marks .

  9. #27
    My name is Sean and I am addicted to STXs smokeysevin's Avatar
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    How do they balance them? Since its a clutched system, the washers, spings, and gear all rotates relative to the wheel and shaft during operation. The shaft and wheel should not rotate relative to eachother though.

    Are they just installing the wheel and shaft and balancing that then adding the other parts? If so I would question the balance on the system. If not, I would question the balance on the system because you have dynamic parts that would have been balanced.

    Not that I am an expert but the wheel should be balanced by itself from the mfg and the shaft should be balanced on its own as well. If they are both balanced on their own the only source of vibration would be eccentricity due to machining fit which should be minimal on such a high speed part.

    Again, not an expert just thinking outloud.

    Sean

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  11. #28
    Quote Originally Posted by smokeysevin View Post
    How do they balance them? Since its a clutched system, the washers, spings, and gear all rotates relative to the wheel and shaft during operation. The shaft and wheel should not rotate relative to eachother though.

    Are they just installing the wheel and shaft and balancing that then adding the other parts? If so I would question the balance on the system. If not, I would question the balance on the system because you have dynamic parts that would have been balanced.

    Not that I am an expert but the wheel should be balanced by itself from the mfg and the shaft should be balanced on its own as well. If they are both balanced on their own the only source of vibration would be eccentricity due to machining fit which should be minimal on such a high speed part.

    Again, not an expert just thinking outloud.

    Sean
    The wheel is balanced by itself on the 300 supercharger.You can check by yourself that the wheel is balanced. Sorry to say but Brp don't balance any 300 supercharger in the way they say.

  12. #29

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    Funny how the 230 charger disappeared from the original post title. Guess it suddenly became not maintenance free......

  13. #30
    If they are balanced as seadoo says when you adjust the slip it is no longer balanced because the grind Mark's no longer line up.

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