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  1. #1

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    Ultra 150 defective labyrinth seal and crank rebuild

    I thought I'd start a new thread on this one since this should be documented.

    I got a rebuilt crank for my ultra 150 and I didn't measure the OD of the labyrinth seals and main bearings prior to installation. The engine ran fine for 20 hours. I didn't use it for January and February. I then started it up in late March and it had a knocking/ticking sound.

    Here's what I did to find out what the noise was. It was definitely not a quick diagnosis.

    Did compression test
    Pulled pump and disengaged driveshaft from the engine then started engine without the pump.
    Checked motor mounts
    Ran motor in the dark to look for arcing
    Looked for loose brackets etc.
    Pulled jugs, checked rings, pistons, rods
    Put top end back together thinking I missed something on the exterior but the noise was still there
    Suspected starter clutch, loose mag cup, balancer bearing, or main bearing
    Pulled engine out
    Turned motor by hand on the bench trying to figure it out by listening with stethoscope
    Pulled intake and reeds - sound stopped
    Put reeds back in and sound returned
    Put reeds only in cylinder one - noise returned



    Put reeds only in cylinder two - noise returned



    Put reeds only in cylinder three - noise disappeared



    Pulled jugs again without removing the heads and only removing the brackets
    Split case
    Found labyrinth seal had fore and aft movement within the crankcase



    Took out crank and measured labyrinth seal and bearings
    Front labyrinth seal OD was smaller than other labyrinth seal. I forgot by how much, but it was only measurable with a digital caliper.
    Also found crank bearing had fore & aft movement on crank



    Crank was under warranty
    The source for the crank honored warranty and sent me another crank
    Went to install new crank and it won't fit.
    I measured the labyrinth seals and bearings before the install, but I didn't catch that the front bearing wasn't the right one. The front bearing on the ultra 150 has a smaller OD than the other bearings.
    The new, new crank had the wrong front bearing pressed onto it and it would not fit into the case.



    The crank supplier honored the second crank and offered to send me another one.
    This time, I drove to the place to get the new, new, new crank, and measured everything before taking it.
    Job done.
    Ski runs great now. Third crank is a charm.

    I guess I should've measured twice the first time and only put the engine together once.
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  2. #2
    raiderteen's Avatar
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    Curious who the supplier was?

  3. #3

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    Quote Originally Posted by raiderteen View Post
    Curious who the supplier was?
    I knew you guys would want to know, but I don't want to bash them. They did honor the warranty, and I understand people including myself make mistakes.

  4. #4
    raiderteen's Avatar
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    I would view the fact they worked with you so much to make it right as favorable and not necessarily as a "bash". I am in process of rebuilding a 150 motor myself and can get a crank through the guy I am having weld my lower casing. I won't use SBT on anything by default so was mainly just curious if there was a new source available that I didn't know about. Especially if they are as helpful as they seemed to be with you.

    Only other option is a used crank. But there are a lot of unknowns going that route. And a lot of time a rebuilt unit isn't that far off used pricing.

  5. #5
    I can't speak for long term reliability but I bought my rebuilt crank from www.pwcengine.com when I rebuilt my engine this summer. So far it is working great. Only time will tell if it holds up. I stayed away from SBT because of this forum.

  6. #6
    steve45's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info and video, FL_Rider! Very interesting!

    And while I would also like to know where you got the crank, I think you are absolutely right to withhold their name. They did the right thing, and you're right, we ALL make mistakes.

  7. #7
    raiderteen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by beekermartin View Post
    I can't speak for long term reliability but I bought my rebuilt crank from www.pwcengine.com when I rebuilt my engine this summer. So far it is working great. Only time will tell if it holds up. I stayed away from SBT because of this forum.
    I too have used them for a crank in the past. Sent mine in before receiving a replacement. Can't say for sure if they rebuilt my unit or sent me a crank that was already rebuilt. My only complaint was their communication or lack there of...took a little over a month and many phone calls with vague answers to timeline and status before finally getting the crank to me.

  8. #8
    Quote Originally Posted by raiderteen View Post
    I too have used them for a crank in the past. Sent mine in before receiving a replacement. Can't say for sure if they rebuilt my unit or sent me a crank that was already rebuilt. My only complaint was their communication or lack there of...took a little over a month and many phone calls with vague answers to timeline and status before finally getting the crank to me.
    They were vague and only had short answers when I talked with them. They also forgot to send me back the coupling, magneto, and other parts I needed from the crank I sent them. They did send them out to me quickly though. The crank did look excellent and there was no obvious play or noise in any of the bearings. Hopefully it holds up for me. I won't know until I can test it more next season.

  9. #9
    I have one of there cranks with over 80hrs, have not had an issue. Mike had great communication with me, no issues there.

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  11. #10
    Spooling's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by raiderteen View Post
    Curious who the supplier was?
    One can make an assumption based on the Geographic Location (FL_Rider) of the OP using the process of elimination as follows:

    Quote Originally Posted by FL_Rider View Post
    This time, I drove to the place to get the new, crank, and measured everything before taking it. Third crank is a charm.
    --------------------
    1. https://pwcengine.com/contact-us/ Manorville, NY 11949
    2. http://crankworks.com/index.php/contact Tempe, AZ85283
    3. https://www.shopsbt.com/contact.htm Clearwater, FL 33755

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